Better motor in the long run?

[gunmetal]

Okay its coming to the point where i need to make up my mind on a motor. It has come down to the b16 or the b18b. I know the b18b will be more expensive all the way around but im for sure going with boost. So im just askin you guys in the long run to get the most power(with out new pistons,rods, ect.) which motor would be better? I am thinkin the b18b just because of lower compress(higher boost) and bigger displacment. What you guys think?

[silverkorn]

well the b18 has the stock lower comp and more torque but the b16 can just rev it out.

boost level vs boost level the b18 will beat it hands down but the b16 i think can handle more before anything goes wrong.

there was a guy on one of the boards who was running 17psi at the track on a stock b16, i think 12-14 on a daily basis. he never had a problem with it. but you have to remember that power comes from your tuning. without proper tuning your just rolling dice to get by and anyday could be your engine's last day

[hondastaR]

B18 will last longer due to the compression ratio. But..... if you plan to do boost, plan on building your motor.  Sooner or later......

[gunmetal]

so you guys think i should stay with the b16? its about a grand cheaper  then the b18b and will be cheaper on parts to put it in.

[silverkorn]

i say yes since you already have it in there. no need to pull out that engine to get a little more torque.

[gunmetal]

yeah i think ill just stick with that. hey silver how much boost can a rev-hard(stage 2) kit push out?

[silverkorn]

im not too sure with the turbo size on the kit but for your application on a stock block... more then enough

[gunmetal]

i have always wondered on thoes TODA stroker kits if they would have the same problem as the LS/V-TECs do to the rod to stroke ratio. Or would it hold up to the higher revs with the stronger rods and what not?

[silverkorn]

the problems with b series engines and their R/S ratio is the cylinder walls cracking and not the rod's breaking. i dont know what the stroke or rod length is of the parts in the kit so i dont know how bad it will make it

[gunmetal]

with like really low compression pistons and stock bottom how much psi could i push? cause that TODA kit makes the R/S ratio just like the LS.

[hondastaR]

the problems with b series engines and their R/S ratio is the cylinder walls cracking and not the rod's breaking.

huh?  Why is it that the rods break on LS motors before the cylinder wall then?  Because R/S ratio isn't an issue.  All the R/S ratio does is limit how high you can rev the motor out.  You can have a funky R/S ratio on a boosted motor and be fine as long as you stay in the intended RPM limit (assuming stock internals of course).    The main things to worry about are compression ratio and air fuel ratio (proper tuning).  Ideally a 10.5:1 to 11.0:1 is ideal for a street driven turbo'd Honda.  As for boost, I wouldn't run more than 8-10psi.

[NeophyteDMD]

From the research I have been doing the R/S of the B16a means your cyl walls won't give in early since it's almost straight up and down. I dunno how big of a lifespan difference it is, but as opposed to any other motor, the B16 has the most life in it. You'll probably wear out the piston ring before the wall wears on a B16a. I say boost the B16a and tune it so VTEC doesn't hurt you. Just IMO

[Goldfingiz]

B18b.

so you guys think i should stay with the b16? its about a grand cheaper  then the b18b and will be cheaper on parts to put it in.

A grand cheaper than the B18b?! NO B18b should ever cost over a grand.

EDIT: If you already have a b16, keep it. It will be just as good to you, if you're good to it

What's all the talk about R/S ratio? Nobody seems to talk about it except people on CRXPower :crazy:

IMO if there was anything WRONG with the R/S ratio, these motors wouldn't last half as long as they do stock. I never worried about R/S ratio...like hondastaR said, focus on your compression and a/f ratio. Make sure the car is tuned correctly and everything will be bueno (translation: good).

[hondastaR]

For shizzle.  R/S ratio isn't something to worry about on a stock block boosted B16/B18.  There is plenty of material in the cylinder sleeves for light boost applications.  I assure you, other stuff will break before the cylinder walls (like the ring lands of the pistons or the connecting rods).  At higher boost levels, well........ lets just say you are better off building up the motor with sleeves and the like.  In my opinion it's better to have a motor that you know is strong enough to withstand a bad tank of gas, a mis-shift, and/or overboosting.  That's just me of course.  Your opinion may vary.

  Now the B20 on the other hand..... well those sleeves don't like a lot of boost or high rpm thrown at them.  Big bore pistons and thin walled open cylinder sleeves aren't a good combination.  Therefore they aren't the best base to build power upon.  Perhaps that is where all of the mis-information on R/S ratio is coming from?   :crazy:

Do it right from the beginning.

 :wink:

Good luck with your setup.


Gregory

[NeophyteDMD]

B18b.

so you guys think i should stay with the b16? its about a grand cheaper  then the b18b and will be cheaper on parts to put it in.

A grand cheaper than the B18b?! NO B18b should ever cost over a grand.

EDIT: If you already have a b16, keep it. It will be just as good to you, if you're good to it

What's all the talk about R/S ratio? Nobody seems to talk about it except people on CRXPower :crazy:

IMO if there was anything WRONG with the R/S ratio, these motors wouldn't last half as long as they do stock. I never worried about R/S ratio...like hondastaR said, focus on your compression and a/f ratio. Make sure the car is tuned correctly and everything will be bueno (translation: good).

ROD/STROKE RATIO AND ROD LENGTH:

B16A: 1.74/ 134MM
B17A1: 1.62/131.87MM
B18A1: 1.54/ 137MM
B18B: 1.54/137MM
B18C1: 1.58/137.9MM
B18C5: 1.58/137.9MM
B20A3/53RD GEN LUDE) 1.50/142.75MM
B21A1: 1.492/141.7MM
B20B: 1.539/137MM


And the ideal R/S for an engine is ~1.75, yay B16a. You forgot that even the Honda schools in Japan hate the B18 engines so much they give them to the students to break and learn with.